Credit question

[David88vert]

This is posed mainly for Jaime, but anyone who has real experience can chime in.

When I pulled my credit score form the 3, of course I got 3 different scores. Hwo do loan companies use them? Do they take the lowest, average the 3, etc?

Just wondering how they determine the actual credit score, since all three are different numbers.

[green91]

From what ive seen companies just have 1 credit union they prefer and dont normally use all 3

[Jaimecbr900]

^^^^ WAYYY off base bud.

For mortgage purposes we do indeed use all 3 credit scores. Most lenders use what we call the "middle" score, which is basically not the highest nor the lowest of the 3 scores. It's not an average because we don't average the scores. We merely use the middle one.

Some lenders do indeed use a single repository score, but it's more rare they do that. However it is more common for other types of credit granters to use a single score. In this part of the country, it is usually Equifax since they are based out of Atlanta and most local creditors subscribe to that one. The west coast uses TransUnion for the same reasons the East coast uses Equifax.....they just do.

They are trying to incorporate new standardized formulas so you have a single score vs 3. I've seen as much as 100 pt difference between repositories. There are many reasons for that, with one being that each repository uses a different and totally confidential formula to derive their score. We've figured out patterns that affect scores, but the actual formulas are a closely guarded secret noone knows.

[green91]

Sorry, i havent had any mortgage experience. However when getting auto loans, utilities, and a personal loan theyd only checked my credit score with one company and i based my statement on that, and since he didnt say he was checking his credit for mortgage related credit it could still be somewhat credible

[David88vert]

I've seen as much as 100 pt difference between repositories. There are many reasons for that, with one being that each repository uses a different and totally confidential formula to derive their score. We've figured out patterns that affect scores, but the actual formulas are a closely guarded secret noone knows.

That's why I was asking. The scores vary by 80 points between the low and high.

[Jaimecbr900]

Sorry, i havent had any mortgage experience. However when getting auto loans, utilities, and a personal loan theyd only checked my credit score with one company and i based my statement on that, and since he didnt say he was checking his credit for mortgage related credit it could still be somewhat credible

Oh no, I wasn't trying to be snooty about it. If you notice I included some verbage in my post about some "other" credit providers only using 1 repository. I know often times cars and banks only use 1. So you are right in a sense. I totally agree with you.

[ueyedgr8tness]

Well mine was only off about 10 points it was 105-102-96.

[green91]

eh i dont think credit scores go that low

[JennB]

They don't.

And yes, everyone is right about cars and other loans being judged on one credit report. I worked in auto finance for a while and we only used Equifax. In a rare occasion where someone knew that something bad was on one of their reports or knew they had very different scores, we would pull a tri-merge report with all three reports combined into one. But that was not standard practice.

[ShooterMcGavin]

i get to check my transunion credit score whenever i want, any way i can find out what the other 2 are reporting?

[Jaimecbr900]

Stay_up: I don't know what kind of scores those are, but they're not from the any of the 3 repositories. Scores range from 400-800.

shag: You have to pay to have them sent to you. You can also go online and basically tell them (wink wink) that you got "turned down" for some credit ap. At that point they HAVE to send you a free copy to be able to dispute anything. Just an idea.

I believe there is a free site that Clark Howard suggests too. Maybe look on his website. I think it's like freecredit.com or something. Just be careful because there are lots of scams out there associated with credit reports. Look on his website because I heard him mention it the other day on his show that the site he promotes is totally free. Give it a try.

[David88vert]

It's freecreditreport.com. They will try to offer you a lot of add-ons also. You just ahve to keep saying no to the add-ons. Every 1 yr, you can request a free credit report, and they have to provide it by law. That's according to their site. So use it when you need it, but don't abuse it.

Jaime, are you sure it only goes up to 800? One of the reports was close to that (under a little), but there is no way that my credit should be that good. I'm no AmEx black card holder....

[ueyedgr8tness]

[QUOTE=Jaimecbr900]Stay_up: I don't know what kind of scores those are, but they're not from the any of the 3 repositories. Scores range from 400-800.


MY bad it was 705-702-696:goodjob:

[ksniperfox]

pretty sure it goes to 830

[Jaimecbr900]

^^^^ Guys, I was rounding. To be exact, credit scores can be anywhere between 350 and 850.

I've never seen anything in the 300's at all. EVER. Not saying it doesn't exist, just that I haven't worked with anyone that low....not that I could since I know of NO lender that will go THAT low.

Now, I have seen and worked with 800's myself.

Just FYI:

For Mortgage purposes (and some other purposes may apply):

500-599- Is usually considered "bad" credit score. Usually there is something either very recent or very large or a lot of accounts that are delinquent.
600-650- Is considered borderline. Usually you have a lot of high credit or lots of inquiries or just lots of debt. Usually people in this range don't have derrog's, but they sometimes can.
651-700- Is usually considered good credit. Usually 680 is our threshold for most lenders to start considering you for better terms.
700-up- Is usually considered good to great credit. This will almost always net you the best terms and the best rates. We always LOVE to see "triple 700's" credit.

Be careful though. There are still other restrictions and program guidelines that apply. Credit score is but one of those. There are MANY 700+ scores that don't qualify for top loan terms. There are MANY a 700+ scores that are really deceiving. You can have a 700+ on just a couple of open accounts, which in turn doesn't always qualify you for a loan. If someone has 9 pgs worth of credit and STILL have a 700+ score......THAT is pimp daddy credit. 2 accts that are less than 12 mos old and you have a 700+ score.....you're on your way possibly, but not considered pimp daddy credit yet. Yall follow?

So just because you have 700+ score doesn't automatically get you the best, but yall can see the general pattern I'm trying to convey.

Hope that helps. ;)

[JennB]

I saw a 380 something once when I worked in auto finance.... I just about fell out of my chair. Bad, very bad. No, he did not get a car. That's when I look at the salesman and say "We can't sell him a car unless someone else outright buys it for him. There is no chance of his name going on a car" and the salesman tells him that and doesn't waste any more time.

[2turbo4u]

Jaime, how long does it take one to improve their credit. Like you paid off your cc then how long would that effect your credit to pull the scores up? I never heard anyone ask this question, even on Clark's show.

[Jaimecbr900]

Jenn: That's nuts. I've seen some WWIII credit reports before. Lots to be honest, but I've never seen one that low. That's gotta be nuts. I'd fall out of my chair too. The funny thing is that people like that come in all smiles and confident you're gonna give them credit when they KNOW their credit stinks :screwy: . What the hell are they thinking???? :thinking: The funniest are the ones that somehow think we're never gonna find out just how bad their credit is. Like we'll just approve a loan and find out LATER or something.... :rolleyes: Don't you just love those people that love to waste your time???? ;)

2turbo4u: That's kind of a trick question. Let me try and answer it by giving you a scenario.

Lots of people mistakenly think that the way to improve their credit score is to pay off and CLOSE as many accounts as possible. BIG no-no. You can certainly pay them off, but DO NOT CLOSE THE ACCOUNT. You can tear up the cards if you want, just DON'T close the account. Some accounts you have no choice (installment loans), but for revolving accounts you do most of the time.

The reason why is because a portion of your credit score is derived from the ratio of HIGH credit (open) to available credit (open). So if you water down the pool from which that ratio is derived, you are lowering your score even if you pay every remaining open account on time. Example:

Mr. X has 5 cc accounts, a car, a mortgage, and a 700 score. The car and the mortgage are installment debt and are pretty much maxed out and not much you can do about that. Therefore, the cc's are going to make the biggest point fluctuation. He wants to raise his score. The best way to do that is to pay down his cc's to where he has a balance of 1/3 of the high credit limit or less on each of his cards BUT LEAVES THEM OPEN. Why? Because should he just pay off and close those cc's, his score will be from only 2 accts that are both maxed out (car and house) so it will be considerably lower rather than higher. If you just pay or maintain your accts, especially revolving accts, at or below 1/3 of the high credit limit.....you will maintain as high of score as normal.

The absolute highest score you will earn is if you have all your accts open but no balances. This is not usually realistic because the creditor usually will close your acct for non-use, but I've seen it done. For example, someone that uses credit cards every so often but pays off the balance at the end of the month and has a house that's paid off and cars that have been paid off. Sometimes those creditors stay reporting on your credit AFTER you've paid them off for up to 7 yrs. It just shows up as a closed acct, but you get the picture.

Usually credit reporting agencies do not report acct activity any sooner than 30 days. Realistically it will be more like 60 days before it will be reported on all your bureaus once you settle something with a creditor. Sometimes it won't even show up then. You have to do the leg work yourself and contact the bureaus to make them update your file.

So to answer your question: It usually takes 30-60 days from the time you settle something or pay something off or make a large payment before it adjusts your score. It can be done faster, but it will be very expensive and requires someone like me that has accts with the repository to have it done quicker. That's called a "re-score" BTW and it usually costs by the acct and by the repository. So if it's $50/acct/repository.....1 acct would be $150. It can and does get expensive. The good thing is that if you know what to do, you can do it all yourself for little or no cost. ;)

[JennB]

We had quite a few really bad ones. I would guess we get more of those in auto finance because people with horrible credit are more likely to try to buy a car than a house.

The guy with the 380 something had charged off phone, some sort of judgment, tax liens, 2 repo's a few years apart, multiple charged off cards. Everything was at its highest balance, not a penny paid on anything. I don't know how he did it.

One of the funniest ones I had was a woman that worked for Bellsouth and had 3 charge-offs.... from Bellsouth.

Or the guy that said "I need to get a new car quick, they are about to come take this one back". WTF NO.

Then there was the very well known local radio DJ that had about a 500. Ouch.

We had a girl once that had her furniture repossessed. She was young and really didn't have a clue what she was doing. She said "I didn't want it anymore, I wanted to buy something different so I stopped paying on it". We had a talk after that.

/end tangent


I have had a little luck with calling a creditor and asking them to report. If you pull up a free copy of your credit report through annualcreditreport.com or the free ones GA requires through the credit bureaus themselves (or one you pay for), it will tell you when they last reported.

[Jaimecbr900]

We had quite a few really bad ones. I would guess we get more of those in auto finance because people with horrible credit are more likely to try to buy a car than a house.

True.


The guy with the 380 something had charged off phone, some sort of judgment, tax liens, 2 repo's a few years apart, multiple charged off cards. Everything was at its highest balance, not a penny paid on anything. I don't know how he did it.

Niiiiiicccceeee..... :goodjob: :D


One of the funniest ones I had was a woman that worked for Bellsouth and had 3 charge-offs.... from Bellsouth.

Or the guy that said "I need to get a new car quick, they are about to come take this one back". WTF NO.

We had a girl once that had her furniture repossessed. She was young and really didn't have a clue what she was doing. She said "I didn't want it anymore, I wanted to buy something different so I stopped paying on it". We had a talk after that.

:lmfao:

They should really teach a class on credit management in high school. Right along side ENGLISH, MATH, common sense, and manners.... :D ;)



I have had a little luck with calling a creditor and asking them to report. If you pull up a free copy of your credit report through annualcreditreport.com or the free ones GA requires through the credit bureaus themselves (or one you pay for), it will tell you when they last reported.

Actually, there is a law in effect now that says something to the effect that your creditors have to accurately report your acct status. I think it even has some deadlines which they are supposed to follow, not that it means anything to them but I think there is. :thinking: I think it's called the fair and accurate report act or something like that. :thinking:

[Jaimecbr900]

It's freecreditreport.com. They will try to offer you a lot of add-ons also. You just ahve to keep saying no to the add-ons. ....


Actually, it's called annualcreditreport.com per the Clark Howard website. He says it's the only true FREE website for getting your credit reports. :goodjob:

[2turbo4u]

Thanks Jaime your the man! Side note why is Seloc so dead?

[Kelly]

I didn't read all of this so you may have already answered this question. What would be considered "good" if you've only started working on your credit for about a year?

[Jaimecbr900]

Thanks Jaime your the man! Side note why is Seloc so dead?

Welcome.

Not sure. We still have our usual events though. Maybe it's just the forum that's kinda quiet. :thinking:

[Jaimecbr900]

I didn't read all of this so you may have already answered this question. What would be considered "good" if you've only started working on your credit for about a year?

What do you mean "started working on your credit"? Were there issues you're trying to fix, or are you just establishing credit?

[Kelly]

Just establishing credit. I took out a loan and got a small credit card last year cuz I had no credit (had to get a co-signer of course).

[Jaimecbr900]

Just establishing credit. I took out a loan and got a small credit card last year cuz I had no credit (had to get a co-signer of course).

Gotcha.

The best thing to do is to get small, sometimes secured, credit cards and pay on them wisely.

Try getting gas cards, store credit cards, or even some of the bigger banks offer secured cards. The interest rates suck, yes, but they do offer a way to "build" your credit file enough to start getting offers from other companies.

Remember the 1/3 rule. No matter what the highest credit is, unless you plan on paying it off at the end of the month, try not to go over 1/3 of the limit. This will help you build your score up quicker.

Be careful with too many inquiries. It can sure enough drop your score quickly. Most creditors get your info sold to them as a "good" prospect for a variety of reasons including your current score. Most "pre-approved" credit card offers start out that way. Your name is sold to this mega credit card company under the assumption that you are someone they're probably interested in because you either just recently got credit or have a good score already. They then turn around and send you all these offers for you to fill out. Everytime you apply for any of those, they may pull your credit. If they do, it will be an inquiry. Too many inquiries and your hard earned score will suffer.

If you get a few smaller accts, the bigger ones will follow soon enough if you keep your nose clean and pay everything like it should be and don't max everything out right away. :goodjob:

[Kelly]

Yeah, I have an apartment too. Will that help build it also?


Thanks :)

[ueyedgr8tness]

MAN nov last yr my credit score was like 590 and its up in the 696-705 range now and thats all just from having 2 credit cards and paying them off every month nnd a cosign on a 4200$ loan keep the cards low and the less u use them the better u will b.

[JennB]

Yeah, I have an apartment too. Will that help build it also?


Thanks :)

No.

Rent and services such as cell phones and utilities have no bearing on your credit unless you don't pay for them and end up with a collection account.

[Kelly]

I knew cell phones and utilities didn't but I thought rent did somewhat. My score was 635 when I checked last month. By the way, you can only pull your score like 3 times a year and after that it will drop your score, right?

[Jaimecbr900]

Yeah, I have an apartment too. Will that help build it also?


Thanks :)


Unfortunately, no. They don't usually report to credit bureaus for the good things. They will report in a heartbeat when you DON'T pay however.

See, a lot of people don't understand that it costs money for a creditor to be a member of the bureau, ie. be able to actively report. Some smaller companies don't want to have that added expense, so they don't report it onto someone's credit unless it's a dire need. Garnishments, judgements, and collections are dire need.....dire need to get your money paid. ;)

[JennB]

I knew cell phones and utilities didn't but I thought rent did somewhat. My score was 635 when I checked last month. By the way, you can only pull your score like 3 times a year and after that it will drop your score, right?

How are you checking it?

If you do it through the credit bureaus, you can check it as often as you like. If you are checking it though a retail establishment somehow, bad idea.

[Kelly]

Through my local bank...

[Jaimecbr900]

Through my local bank...

How? Is a friend there pulling it for you?

[Kelly]

No, I extended my loan to pay off my car. She told me then.

[Jaimecbr900]

No, I extended my loan to pay off my car. She told me then.


That probably means she pulled it. If she did, it's another inquiry.

I keep bringing up inquiries because I see this happen too often. People are hard at work trying to build their credit, only to have it back slide because of too many inquiries. Don't let anyone pull your credit unless you absolutely have to. A lot of places ask for your SS# and pull your credit for no good reason. I get pissed at people and even refuse to use their services if they push for me to give them personal info I KNOW they don't need. It's not that I don't want them to see my credit, because I have great credit. I just want to KEEP it that way....you know?

Just be careful. It may be better for you to either request your score directly from the repository itself or thru that annualcreditreport.com thing I mentioned earlier. Clark Howard swears by that and mentions it on his show a lot.

[Kelly]

Thanks for the info +1

[Jaimecbr900]

Thanks for the info +1

Anytime. :goodjob:

[Sammich]

Jenn: That's nuts. I've seen some WWIII credit reports before. Lots to be honest, but I've never seen one that low. That's gotta be nuts. I'd fall out of my chair too. The funny thing is that people like that come in all smiles and confident you're gonna give them credit when they KNOW their credit stinks :screwy: . What the hell are they thinking???? :thinking: The funniest are the ones that somehow think we're never gonna find out just how bad their credit is. Like we'll just approve a loan and find out LATER or something.... :rolleyes: Don't you just love those people that love to waste your time???? ;)

2turbo4u: That's kind of a trick question. Let me try and answer it by giving you a scenario.

Lots of people mistakenly think that the way to improve their credit score is to pay off and CLOSE as many accounts as possible. BIG no-no. You can certainly pay them off, but DO NOT CLOSE THE ACCOUNT. You can tear up the cards if you want, just DON'T close the account. Some accounts you have no choice (installment loans), but for revolving accounts you do most of the time.

The reason why is because a portion of your credit score is derived from the ratio of HIGH credit (open) to available credit (open). So if you water down the pool from which that ratio is derived, you are lowering your score even if you pay every remaining open account on time. Example:

Mr. X has 5 cc accounts, a car, a mortgage, and a 700 score. The car and the mortgage are installment debt and are pretty much maxed out and not much you can do about that. Therefore, the cc's are going to make the biggest point fluctuation. He wants to raise his score. The best way to do that is to pay down his cc's to where he has a balance of 1/3 of the high credit limit or less on each of his cards BUT LEAVES THEM OPEN. Why? Because should he just pay off and close those cc's, his score will be from only 2 accts that are both maxed out (car and house) so it will be considerably lower rather than higher. If you just pay or maintain your accts, especially revolving accts, at or below 1/3 of the high credit limit.....you will maintain as high of score as normal.

The absolute highest score you will earn is if you have all your accts open but no balances. This is not usually realistic because the creditor usually will close your acct for non-use, but I've seen it done. For example, someone that uses credit cards every so often but pays off the balance at the end of the month and has a house that's paid off and cars that have been paid off. Sometimes those creditors stay reporting on your credit AFTER you've paid them off for up to 7 yrs. It just shows up as a closed acct, but you get the picture.

Usually credit reporting agencies do not report acct activity any sooner than 30 days. Realistically it will be more like 60 days before it will be reported on all your bureaus once you settle something with a creditor. Sometimes it won't even show up then. You have to do the leg work yourself and contact the bureaus to make them update your file.

So to answer your question: It usually takes 30-60 days from the time you settle something or pay something off or make a large payment before it adjusts your score. It can be done faster, but it will be very expensive and requires someone like me that has accts with the repository to have it done quicker. That's called a "re-score" BTW and it usually costs by the acct and by the repository. So if it's $50/acct/repository.....1 acct would be $150. It can and does get expensive. The good thing is that if you know what to do, you can do it all yourself for little or no cost. ;)

EXCELLENT READ REPS FOR YOU

btw where would i go generally to get a credit rescore?

[Jaimecbr900]

EXCELLENT READ REPS FOR YOU

btw where would i go generally to get a credit rescore?

Thank you.

You have 2 choices: Do it yourself or have someone else do it for you.

Now, I'm not talking about "credit repair" services which are usually schemes. I'm talking about someone whom you are working with to get a house or a car that is willing to help you go to the proper channels to send in any disputes or clarifications you have to expedite the process.

You can certainly do it yourself. You can go into each of the repositories' websites and they have their exact procedure and contact info for disputes. Most you can do right online. It costs you nothing. It is also a legal right that you have and the bureaus have laws which they are forced to be under, but most won't do so until SOMEONE (you or otherwise) holds their feet to the fire.

BTW, the websites are:

www.equifax.com
www.transunion.com
www.experian.com

This is also good reading about credit reports in general:

https://www.econsumer.equifax.com/consumer/sitepage.ehtml?forward=elearning_credit14

Here is the direct link to the website Clark Howard says is the best:

https://www.annualcreditreport.com/cra/index.jsp